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From the “Mecca of Mormonism”
This . . . is Heart of the Matter!
Show 110 –  17 Points Part 1
April 15th 2008
 
And I’m your host, Shawn McCraney.
 
LIVE STREAMING VIDEO
 
NO MORE (IN THE HOUSE)
We love seeing you, but we have to move on, progress, adapt.
 
 . . . Speaking of adaptation, many of you have noticed that we’ve taken the message board down on our site.
 
You have also noticed that we have stopped doing the local Pastor in the Pub after the show.
 
Why?
 
This ministry has been around now for over four years.
 
We have tried to be a place for people to meet and greet and exchange ideas.
 
We no longer care to be that place  - especially for LDS defenders of the faith.
 
Actually, I publicly repent for allowing these “exchanges” to occur.
 
I have acted like the owner of a magazine rack who, in the name of being fair to free speech, has allowed pornography to sit on my shelves.
 
Well intentioned people have come to my stand for reliable information and have been exposed to confusing and pernicious materials from confused and pernicious men and women.
 
Life is too short to allow anyone the chance to muddy the clear and living water offered by the Biblical Jesus.
 
So we are headed in a new direction – more instruction and information about Christianity.
 
More video testimonies from people who have left Mormonism because they have come to know who Jesus really is.
 
More time spend presenting truth rather than defending ourselves against lies.
 
Okay . . .
 
Hey, on the first Monday night in May, in the backyard of a beautiful Sandy Utah home, we are going to hold another open water baptism.
 
If you have not made a public profession of Jesus as LORD and SAVIOR through baptism, we invite you to come on out.
 
Go to www.bornagainmormon.com
 
 
Then, coming in June, we are going to hold our first annual WAR CAMP – a two day, one night Christian retreat for men.
 
Bring your fishing poles, a sleeping bag and some grub.
 
We’re going to meet riverside here in beautiful Utah and talk about what it means to be a true Christian man.
 
All males, all ages, welcome.
 
Now listen, ladies, if you want to organize something for women in Utah, let me know.  We’ll support it if it has to do with teaching women what the Word says about being better Christian women.
 
REIGN DOWN USA
Announcement
 
Polygamy Release (sent to us by Josie)
(comment)
 
 
The Stone Cutter John sent me an email about a hymn he recently heard:
 
All Creatures of our God and King, written by Saint Francis of Assisi.
 
John came to know the Lord and left Mormonism and was bowled over by David Crowder, a Christians, rendition of this hymn.
 
A member of John’s LDS family reminded him that the LDS have this hymn in their hymnbook.
 
So John looked it up and discovered something very troubling:
 
They neutered the song!
 
And entire verse of praise to God was removed.
 
Someday we should do a show on what the LDS have removed from the hymns they have taken from the Christian world.
 
I spent an entire week comparing and contrasting these editorials and it is amazing.
 
John the stonecutter was right to be upset.
 
He – and I – challenge you to listen to David Crowder’s version of All Creatures of our God and King and then look at the LDS version.
 
You’ll be first amazed and inspired, then dismayed.
 
On a very interesting side note, I received a call from the LDS Church Headquarters last week.
 
A man named Robert Howell in the Public Relations department there in the Church HQ said he had been receiving a number of calls regarding the named John who was claiming to be LDS and in a bishopric.
 
I let Brother Howell say his piece.
 
He let me know in no uncertain terms that John did NOT represent the LDS Church and that he was pretty certain no such person named John O’Fallon was in a bishopric in Nauvoo, Illinois.
 
When he was done presenting his position I let him in on a few important – but very public - bits of information.
 
I first explained that the man may in fact call himself “John” on the air but we don’t know if that is his real name or not.  People often use pseudonyms.
 
Secondly, his last name is not O’Fallon, but he, instead, was calling from O’Fallon Illinois.
 
Third, Nauvoo has never been brought up in connection to John or his calls.  I don’t know where they got that information.
 
And finally, I explained that John has never presented himself as a representative of the Church, but only as a believing faithful member of the Church who served as a member of a Bishopric.
 
Brother Howell then stood corrected.
 
But he went on to say that surely we would want someone, in the name of accuracy and fairness, to represent the Church correctly when they called in to the show.
 
“What do you mean?” I asked.
 
He said that no true member of the Church would make a comment like John did about “forbidding his wife from” watching or saying my name in their house.
 
I said that while he or I may not be that way, that there are certainly many men – LDS and not – who maintain such attitudes toward their wives.
 
Brother Howell then sort of transitioned  into the job title he assumes – public relations guy for the Church – when he related that he too, had one time been involved in television – screening callers actually – and that so much could be done to prevent the “not so reliables” from getting through on the air.
 
It was as if he was trying to nicely suggest that we do a better job of screening our callers.
 
I maintain that whether John is truly LDS or not, he embodies the traditional stalwart LDS male attitude.
 
Brother Howell said something about wanting to find John in order to “stop him.”
 
And then the call ended – amicably – but sort of annoyingly.
 
In relation to this subject, we had a self-appointed defender of the LDS faith email us and proclaim that he is:
 
“95% certain that John O’Fallon is not a member of the LDS church.”
 
Typical – an LDS apologist claiming near-“certain knowledge” about a topic . . . and he doesn’t even have his facts right.
 
Oh well, oh well, oh well.
 
Finally, two weeks ago at our traveling pastor meeting in American Fork, I met a man who used to be LDS whose name was Jim.
 
Jim and his wife were a very kindly slightly older couple and though they love the show, Jim disagreed with a stance I have maintained relative to people having their names taken off the rolls of the Church.
 
Most of you know that I have said it really is a personal thing that doesn’t matter.
 
If you want to do it, go for it.  If you don’t, don’t worry about it.
 
We’ll here I am again, repenting.  Because Jim opened my eyes.
 
I would now strongly recommend that ANYONE who has considered taking their name off the Church records to do it.
 
En masse.
Here is the reasoning:
 
First, it will send a message loud and clear:  we are not going to put up with your shenanigans any longer, Mormonism.
 
Change your doctrines and practices or watch your membership numbers fall.
 
Secondly, it sends a message to all the Bishops and Stake presidents telling them the same thing.
 
Third, it causes them to work, to fill out paperwork and bureaucratic forms and could, in the end, result in people from inside saying, “Why?”
 
“Why?” is such a great question for people to ask themselves.
 
So from this point forward, Alathea Ministries supports a
 
SEND A MESSAGE campaign.
 
Send a message today, my friends.
 
Get up and write that letter to the Bishop of your ward.
 
Send a message that says you are tired of being ostracized.
 
Send a message loud and clear that you don’t believe in golden plates, becoming a God, or secret temple rituals.
 
Send a message to them because in the end, your message just might speak to others.  And get this beast to change.

PRAYER  PRAYER  PRAYER
 
Two weeks ago, if you recall, we introduced the paradigm or model for script writing.
 
It consists of three acts – the set up in Act One, the conflict in Act Two, and the resolution in Act III.
 
And we said we we’re going to present  the basic elements of “Mormonism” in this three act format – calling it “twistianity.”
 
This tool may help you understand the “what’s and why’s” of Mormonism relative to biblical Christianity.
 
You’ll see from the graphic that the set up act consists of the LDS beliefs supposedly taken from the pre-mortal existence.
 
All of these points in the “set-up of  Mormonism act” are based on things which Joseph Smith claimed relative to his teachings on a “pre-existence.”
 
These include -
 
An eternal regression of Gods.
Jesus as a created being and elder brother.
A renunciation of the Trinity.
Satan as our spirit brother.
The Fall being upward and good.
All human beings are God’s children from the start.
 
Okay?  So Mormon doctrine is pretty much set up by what Joseph Smith described from his doctrines on the “pre-existence.”
 
Most of the teachings relative to salvation, this life, after life, are founded in these elements of Act One.
 
Now that the stage has been set, let’s move on to the next Act of this script – Act II - conflict.
 
These scenes in the “Conflict Act” are things Mormonism claims which Christianity is either lacking in or has lost completely.
 
The real “conflict” here is actually between what the Bible teaches and how Joseph and the LDS interpret what it says.
 
Tonight, we’re going to address the idea of there being only “One True Church.”
 
Now the LDS maintain the idea that Jesus established a church consisting of “institutionalized offices” – you know, “one True literal-under one roof so to speak Congregation” rather than a body of spiritually reborn believers who follow all sorts of organized paths to God.
 
They insist Jesus “organized” an institutional construct that was to carry on as “His Church” until He returns.
 
This model relates much, much closer to the Roman Catholic claims than the claims of those Churches which formed during and after the Protestant reformation.
 
In fact, LDS Apostle Legrand Richards once made a great either/or claim years ago in a book called, A Marvellous Work and A Wonder, which said (and I’m paraphrasing here) “that the true Church on earth is either Catholicism or Mormonism, which ridiculously infers that either the Catholics still have the authority of Christ or, they lost that authority and so God had to restore it back to the earth through one Joseph Smith.”
 
In other words, where the Catholics claim uninterrupted authority to act for Christ through a priesthood lineage which has come down since Peter, Mormonism claims this authority was lost and corrupted, and needed to be “restored” to the earth – and was restored to the earth - through Joseph Smith.
 
This whole premise is nothing but a big fat straw man, based on a selective and misinterpreted readings from the Bible, and the acceptance of a number of man-made ideations.
 
When Jesus said to Peter:
 
Upon this “rock” I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it,” the Catholics have selectively ignored a truck load of other verses and have purposefully used this line to suggest that Jesus built His Church entirely upon Peter and a line of “infallible” successors.
 
But the LDS, in the shadows of the dark ages, have injected themselves with selective amnesia by forgetting that Jesus also said, “And the gates of hell will NOT prevail against” this church He established!”
 
According to LDS teachings, the gates of hell did, in fact prevail against the Lord Church, so much so that the true “church” as they have it painted was completely removed from the earth!
 
I would suggest that everyone should ask themselves:
 
“What did Jesus establish when He was on the earth?  What did it look like?  Was it a formal actual “building” containing ordinances and religiosity and dogma or was it a saving message that redeems people through all sorts
miraculous manners, means and ways?
 
Next, shouldn’t we ask ourselves, “Did Jesus fail in establishing this Gospel of salvation once and for all?  When He said, “It is finished,” was He kidding?  Did the gates of hell prevail, leaving millions of people shortly after His ascension in stumble in the dark until Joseph Smith came along to fix what Jesus couldn’t do Himself?”
 
I think you should also ask yourself:
 
What would controlling men say God established on earth (to retain power) and what would God establish on earth to save people?
 
Controlling men would tell you that God ONLY operates in this Church, in this way, with these exact beliefs and practices and lifestyles.  You must do this.  You must be that.  You must have this baptism, that ordinance (that only we can give you).
 
But the Bible says
 
Galatians 3:28 “There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.”
 
In Christ Jesus we are all one.
 
Finally, you will need to ask yourself over the next few weeks, if the construction of Mormonism is what the Bible says it is, or is it what LDS men (and now women) have made the Bible say it is.
 
Now, years ago, there was a LDS man named Griffith who wrote a thing called “The Seventeen Points of the True Church.”
 
I believe – someone correct me if I am wrong – that the LDS Church publishes these points on little cards and that members and missionaries alike will pass them out.  What is especially deceptive about this little piece is it uses the Bible to support its claims.
 
I want to read them to you.
 
When you hear them, especially if you do not have any experience in the Word of God, they may sound fairly reasonable.
 
But when you take them one by one – which were going to do – and compare them with a contextual understanding of what the Word says, you will see that some of them are half-truths and some of them are flat out misrepresentations of the biblical verses they use to support them.
 
(Read the 17 Points)
 
We’ll let’s cover the first two tonight, and the remaining 15 over the next few weeks.
 
(SHOW Graphic)
 
ACT I – The Set up
LDS Beliefs
An eternal regression of Gods.
Jesus as a created being and our spirit “elder-brother.”
A renunciation of the Trinity.
Satan as our spirit brother too.
The Fall being upward and good.
All human beings are God’s children.
 
(SHOW GRAPHIC)
 
ACT II – Conflict
 
The “True”Church of Jesus Christ

Point One: Christ organized the Church.
 
Think about this!  Of course for the Church to be the real Church Christ (Jesus) would have organized it!
 
And He did – over 2000 years ago.
 
And it consists of a body of believers who all fill and act in different capacities from a host of different “churches” spread throughout the world.
 
The LDS use Ephesians 4:11-14 to support this statement which they are applying to themselves.
 
It reads:
 
Ephesians 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive.
 
What the LDS fail to add to this first point is another passage in the previous chapter in Ephesians 3: 21, which reads:
 
Eph 3:21 Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end.
 
You see, Jesus established His Church and it is, has been, and always will be built of believers, who are founded in the faith by the Word.
 
Do you notice that it reads in verse twenty-one “Unto Him be glory in the church throughout ALL ages?”
 
The Church – a body of believers – have always existed since Jesus formed His Church, throughout all ages.
 
It was not “re-organized” or “restored” to the earth through Joseph Smith.
 
Point Two: The True Church must bear the name of Jesus Christ!  And they use Ephesians 5:23 to support this, which reads:
 
Eph 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
 
How this passage support this little carnival trick doctrine is beyond me.
 
Of course Christ is the head of His Church – the chief cornerstone – but nowhere does it say the individual gatherings of believers must use His name outside on the door.
 
I mean, we all do call ourselves “Christians,” do we not?
 
Biblically, the Church collective is aptly referred to as “the Church of Christ,” and “the Body of Christ,” but does this mean “the body of Christ should be in the letterhead of every gathering?
 
Isn’t people being known individually as Christians enough?
 
Who came up with this “point or requirement?”  I’ll tell you who.
 
Joseph Smith lived at a time when people were seeking to re-establish what they felt was the lost Christian faith.
 
One of the leaders of this restorationist movement was named Alexander Campell.
 
He had a list of points or requirements of what must be in the truly restored Church and the name of Jesus in the title was one of the biggies.
 
If this is the case, why does the New Testament speak of
 
1Co 1:2 “the church of God which is at Corinth,”
 
“the church at Cenchrea”
 
Paul saluted the “churches of Asia” as they were known, and spoke of.
 
“the church of God which is at Corinth,”
 
“the church of the Laodiceans”
 
“the church of the Thessalonians”
 
“the church of the living God”
 
Timotheus, ordained the first bishop of the church of the Ephesians
 
Titus was ordained the first bishop of the church of the Cretians.
 
And what about the seven Churches in Revelations?  The Church of Ephesus?
 
The Church at Thiatyra?
 
NOWHERE does the Bible say the name of a Church needs to include the name of Jesus Christ.
 
Why?
 
Because salvation is not in Church memberships.
 
Salvation is in a relationship with Jesus Christ directly.
 
Alright, we’ll cover the remainder next week.
 
Let’s open the phone lines up:
 
(801) 973-TV20
(801) 973-8820
 
EMAILS?
 
Conclusion:
 
Hey, just want to send our love and prayers out to Brandon and Kara and Millie.
 
Brandon has come to a saving knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ, received Him, and now walks by faith in Him and Him alone.
 
We love you brother.
 
We’ll see you next week, here on Heart of the Matter.