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. . . this is Heart of the Matter . . .
Show 11 The Fall Part II
March 4th 2008
And I’m Shawn McCraney, your host.
 
LIVE STREAMING VIDEO
IN THE HOUSE
Report on Tooele Traveling Pastor
 
Last night we held our monthly traveling pastor in Tooele.
 
We met at the Denny’s out there and had a great group.
 
Baptisms?
(show Video)
 
Hey, just to let you know, our up and coming Traveling Pastor’s get together’s are going to be as follows:
 
(SHOW GRAPHIC)
 
April 7th   American Fork
May 5th     St. George
June 23rd  Manti at the Manti Pagent
July 7th      Park City
August 4th Logan
NO SEPTEMBER – Heart in the Park
October 6th Provo
November 3rd Ogden
December 4th our 2nd Annual Christmas Open House!
 
Go to www.bornagainmormon.com for a listing of these dates and places.
 
Hey, on Friday evening, April 11th and Saturday, April 12th there is going to be an outstanding Bible Conference coming to town.
 
“Rooted and Raised in Truth”
 
Now there is a cost to this event, but I think it would be well worth it for the experience and knowledge.
 
Fantastic Qualified Speakers out of Texas
 
Lunch
Breakfast
Free Parking at the E Center
 
Call 801 280-8747
or email info@aletheiatruth.com
 
Some of you may or many not be aware of this but if you go online and do a Yahoo or Google search under my name
 
Shawn McCraney or Bornagainmormon
 
You will discover a whole host of video clips which have been taken and placed on places like Youtube, Godtube, and all sorts of other video hosting sites.
 
It is truly amazing.  Our gratitude to our supporters who have taken the time to edit and post portions of our shows online – especially you, Andreas.
 
As the ministry takes off and gets more and more known around the world, there are more and more detractors popping up, especially since the LDS leadership has told its membership to step forward online and defend their faith.
 
Somebody recently made me aware of a Latter-day Saint who took the LDS apostles request to heart.
 
We thought we’d share with you tonight what some LDS are doing to defend their faith.
 
(PLAY YOUTUBE “Shawn McFlakey”)
 
I think the video speaks for itself.
 
 
Lot’s of video clips tonight, folks.
 
Last week, a caller named ________ and I went the rounds on “knowing” and on who truly knows Jesus and how this knowledge actually plays out in their lives.
 
In the end, the caller was defending a relativist, postmodern position which essentially erases all claims for absolute truth and instead presents to the world this idea that “your way is fine and my way is fine and nothing is black and nothing is white.”
 
“We’re just all allright.”
 
Now, much of this attitude within Christianity is the fault of Christianity itself – and in my opinion, it has occurred as a direct result of pastors and preachers turning away from teaching the Word effectively to their people.
 
Never the less, a postmodern attitude exists in this world and I suppose always will.
 
Amazingly enough, Hollywood has presented us with a dramatic scene where a dying man, who is seeking for some absolute truth in the face of death, has a meeting with a female postmodern pastor who, like our caller last week, could not give Him any real truth upon which he could rely.
 
Take a look from this scene from ER:
 
(Play ER clip)
 
Since the beginning of our ministry the greatest personal frustration I’ve had has been in relation to the LDS claim that my experience in Mormonism was “defective” and that the things I say about modern-day Mormonism simply don’t exist.
 
“Why I’ve been a member of the Church all my life, Shawn” they will say in a kindly voice of compassion, “and I’ve never seen or heard anything like that before.”
 
Because the doctrines we present are “provable” and are almost always in print somewhere, their denials are usually in reference to the “attitudes and general opinions” the Saints maintain and share within their ranks.
 
From my experience, I will claim the LDS are spiritually arrogant, but they will claim they are only “confident” in the truths they have come to know.
 
I will say they have “hidden agenda’s” or that they do not speak the truth publicly.  Then they will claim that they only share what people can understand.
 
 
Last week we received a call from a man who identified himself as John. He said he was from Illinois and served in a ward Bishopric.
 
Because of John’s tone, I think he was legitimate and represented a stalwart member of the LDS church.
 
It was the call I had been waiting to receive on the air for two years.
 
You see, there is a public persona which most LDS maintain and then there is an attitude they will exhibit to one another, or to those who are in “the know” or the elect.
 
I suggest that their history of persecution, the political environment existing within the Church, the secret temple rites, and the “us verses them” mentality with the outside world has served to promote and perfect this public/private persona.
 
Finally, last week, we had an LDS caller somehow forget that he was talking on live television.
 
Before we watch the clip of John’s call, I’d like you to listen for a few things in the tape:
 
First, listen to the tone John has in his voice.  This is a learned tone, shared by most LDS men who sincerely believe that they actually represent God’s priesthood here on earth.
 
They use it like a tool.
 
Second, listen to John’s references.  To whom does he say I will be ashamed?
 
Joseph Smith.
 
To whom does he say I will look up and see from outer darkness?
 
Joseph Smith.
 
To whom does he say’s face will be shining like the noon day sun?
 
You got it.  Why didn’t John mention Jesus?  Because He is not truly in the collective LDS heart.
 
Finally, when I countered and questioned John, when I refused to accept his claim to being a high priest, and frankly shoved it right back in his face, what did John do?
 
He spoke the abundance of his heart, that’s what he did.
 
He revealed the secret contents of his very LDS heart. 
 
Watch and hear.
 
 . . . You know, people have criticized us for saying that Mormonism is not as it seems.
 
That Mormonism doesn’t deserve a United States President.
 
They tell us we are hateful, that we are bigoted, that we are dangerous because we just don’t embrace Mormonism and “all the good it does.”
 
I’m telling you, having been in the religion for forty years solid – the organization  called Mormonism –
from the roots of Joseph Smith up –
is founded on the ideas of Man and is nothing but humanism in disguise.
 
It is the best of humanism – and the worst.
 
Their general intent is to overtake then govern the world, if not by loving persuasion, then by might.
 
(ROLL SEGMENT FROM LAST WEEK)
Let’s have a Word with the Lord.
 
Lord, they say we are unfair – but we try our best to share only your truths.
 
They say we are anti-Mormon, Lord, but we simply want the LDS to experience the saving Grace of Jesus.
 
Lord, they say we are evil – they threaten us and mock us and try us.  But we pray tonight, Lord, that you will open eyes and ears and hearts of those seeking your truth in their lives.
 
This is our hope.
 
In Jesus name.
Last week we continued to speak about the Fall.
 
We talked about the LDS view that Adam had to sin to bring about God’s wishes and we said this was not so.
 
We explained that to the LDS way of thinking, that God gave Adam two commandments – to mutiply and replenish the earth with children and to not eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil – and that in their teachings, the only way to obey the one was to disobey the other.
 
In other words, the only way Adam and Eve would know how to multiply was to eat of the tree, which would give them the knowledge on how to do it.
 
We received a really insightful call from ________________ who pointed out that God had commanded the animals to multiply and replenish the earth prior to the fall too.
 
Again, was this an empty command on God’s part or were the animals capable of carrying out God’s will obediently?
 
Finally, we asked a question:
 
If eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil was a good thing as the LDS claim, and would enable Adam and Eve to create bodies for the spirits in heaven, WHY would Satan tempt Eve to eat of the fruit, knowing full well that in so doing, God’s plan would be put into effect.
 
It makes no sense.
 
Before we discuss this “fall upward” as the LDS call it, or whether they transgressed or sinned, and how the LDS interpretation of the Fall plays out into their ideas on salvation, the virgin birth, etc., there is an area I have to cover tonight or I will not be doing you the viewer justice:
 
It’s called the Adam God Doctrine.
 
Now, let me make some things perfectly clear:
 
I am sharing this teaching with you but the LDS have – HAVE – renounced this teaching.
 
They have?
 
Yes, amazingly enough, they have publicly renounced the teaching of the Adam/God doctrine (or what they call the Adam/God Theory).
 
“So why would you be talking about this teaching?” you might ask.
 
By the time were done, you will understand.
 
Now this teaching, which was introduced by Brigham Young to the Church, has been a miserable doctrine to Mormonism’s desire for legitimacy.
 
They have attempted to say and do all sorts of things to make it seem like it was never “really” taught, or that it was never really doctrine, or that it was never really understood in the way it was intended.
 
After you hear the facts – you tell us whether it was really taught or intended or not – okay?
 
Now, obviously, the Adam/God doctrine stands against the Bible – completely.
 
But admittedly, it also stands against the Book of Mormon.
 
Church President Spencer W. Kimball publicly stated that the Adam/God doctrine was “false doctrine” even though it was taught as true doctrine by Brigham Young for over 19 years and was embraced by the church for fifty years!
 
Now I challenge you to go and read for yourselves what this doctrine was about.
 
Go to UTLM.org and read the actual reproduced photocopies of it or go to the Journal of Discourses (volume 1) and read it directly from the source.
 
What did Brigham Young say or teach in this false doctrine?
 
In a sermon he said:
 
“Now hear it, O inhabitants of the earth, Jew and Gentile. Saint and sinner!  When our father Adam came into the garden of Eden, he came into it with a celestial body, and brought Eve, one of his wives, with him.  He helped to make and organize this world.  He is Michael, the Archangel, the Ancient of Days! about whom holy men have written and spoken – he is our father and our God, and the only God with whom we have to do!”
 
Now listen, all alone, this is a preposterous statement, but this teaching was not a singular outlandish alip of the tongue for Young, serving as the prophet, seer, and revelator of the Church.  It was a taught by him repeatedly, AND it was embraced by the LDS faithful throughout their lives.
 
Brigham Young also made the claim that once he has spoken, and then corrected anything errant, his words were SCRIPTURE. But he never corrected anything about his Adam/God teachings throughout his life, so he was presenting this teaching as THE WORD OF GOD.
 
LDS defenders today try and say it was never taught as doctrine, or that Brigham never intended it to be.
 
But a year after he delivered this sermon on Adam God, it was printed in the LDS Millenial Star and was then reproduced in the JOD where Brigham Young completely endorsed it.
 
In fact, Young was still teaching the Adam/God doctrine over two decades later.
 
It seems the people were having some trouble accepting this teaching (praise God) which caused Young to say on June 18th 1873:
 
“How much unbelief exists in the minds of Latter-day Saints in regard to one particular DOCTRINE which I revealed to them and which GOD REVEALED TO ME . . . namely, that Adam is our Father and our God.”
 
Later in the speech, he has Adam explain himself (in part) by saying:
 
“I want my children to are in the spirit world to come and live here. I once dwelt on an earth something like this, in a mortal state.  I was faithful.  I received my crown and exaltation (meaning He became a God).  I have the privilege of extending my work, and to its increase there will be no end.  I want my children that were born to me in the spirit world to come and take tabernacles of flesh, that their spirits may have a house, a tabernacle or a dwelling place as mine has, and where is the mystery.”
 
Prominent LDS leader F.D Richards said in the Millenial Star:
 
“Concerning the doctrine that Adam is our Father and God . . . the prophet and apostle Brigham has declared it, and that is the word of the Lord.”
 
George Q Cannon said: “Jesus Christ is Jehovah and Adam is His Father and our God.”
 
Hosea Stout in his journal wrote:
“Another meeting this evening.  Brigham Young taught that Adam was the Father of Jesus and the only God to us.”
 
In the Minutes from the LDS School of the Prophets, ten to fifteen years after Brigham Young first taught the Adam/God doctrine, LDS member A.F. McDonald wrote:
 
“ . . . when I first heard the doctrine of Adam being our Father and God, I was favorably impressed – enjoyed and hailed it as “new revelation – it appeared reasonable to me as the father of our spirits, that he should introduce us here.”
 
I think this quote brings out an important point which needs to be understood about the Adam/God teaching, now refuted by the LDS as false. 
 
That is, the teaching was that Adam, whose true identity was Michael above, had once been a man on another world and had reached Godhood through his faithfulness.
 
He had acquired many wives who were sealed to him in this earlier life, and in our pre-existent state, which was his celestial glory state, he procreated spirit children with these wives. 
 
Then he – as Michael – came to earth with a celestial body with one of his wives, became Adam, fell upward purposefully, and then with Eve began to procreate physical bodies for their spirit children waiting above.
 
This was the teaching, by the Mormon prophet, which was considered truth, and embraced by the LDS people under his care, as doctrine from God.
 
And herein lies the rub.
 
First, Brigham, as the Prophet of the LDS believers either told them an eternal truth or he told them a lie.
 
Which would mean Spencer W Kimball, as the Prophet of the LDS believers, either told us the truth, or he told us a lie.
 
In either case, the machinations of Man have lead the LDS people astray.
 
Second, listen to the Mormonicious way in which Spencer W. Kimball recinds the Adam/God doctrine.
 
There are two key words here that make this statement categorically insidious.
 
In the October 9th 1976 Church News, Kimball said:
 
“We warn you against the dissemination of doctrines which are not according to scriptures and which are alleged to have been taught by some of the general authorities of past generations.  Such, for instance, is the Adam/God theory. We denounce that theory and hope that everyone will be cautious against this and other kinds of false doctrine.”
 
SO while it is perfectly acceptable for men like Brigham Young to teach whatever the hell inspires them as truth, and then it is the right of men like Spencer W. Kimball to retroactively denounce what they have said as false, who loses in this game of doctrinal and authoritative masturbation?
 
Those who believe either of them.
 
My friends – my LDS brothers and sisters – there was a time when good (in the sense the world sees good) and hardworking men and women walked this earth believing that Adam was the literal Father of their spirits.
 
And then there came a time when an LDS prophet said this was a lie – that it was false!
 
What is the lesson?
Walk from this MAN –ipulation and turn to the Word of God for truth.
 
Turn to Jesus Christ.
 
Call out to Him.
 
Make Him, and your faith in Him and Him alone the focal point of your temporal and spiritual lives.
 
Turn your will and ways over to Him.
 
You don’t need me or this show.
 
You don’t need Joseph, or Brigham, or Thomas, or their standard works – you need Him.
 
And His Word.
 
Let’s open up the phones:
 
(801) 973-TV20
(801) 973-8820
 
Emails:
 
Conclusion:
 
Lordsword
 
See you next week, here on Heart of the Matter.
 
(Graffic for Lord’sword)